Education Cabinet Secretary Prof. George Magoha and his Interior counterpart Fred Matiang’i are now insisting on the return of corporal punishment in schools.
The two CSs attributed the high occurrence of school fires to growing indiscipline among learners.
The push for the reintroduction of the cane comes at a time dozens of learners are in police custody in different parts of the country in connection to the torching property worth millions of shillings in their respective schools. [\QUOTE]
So…
Why not apply the same medicine to the entire corrupt leadership with a view to end graft and impunity …??? :D:D:D
This is retrogressive and it should not be unopposed. Find the real cause of school unrest and expel the students, jail them or whatever other punishment that is legal. Bring back approved schools. Find out if there are outside influences too, and deal with those. Investigate the issue seriously. But changing existing laws to take the country back to the days of caning and subjecting a whole generation of children to legitimized physical violence so as to make teachers feel powerful is both obscene and unwise. I don’t believe in corporal punishment and I cannot support it, it destroys lives. It will create more serious problems. If there are currently cases of children killing adults, Matiang’i and Magoha need to reason like the sane people we expect them to be. That public show of anger, and declaring that children’s rights are not important will cost them. Children are people, immature, confused, and emotional people. Let’s approach this with a lot of caution. It is not simple. This calls for a concerted and balanced national discussion, it’s not the preserve of the two CS’s to make that kind of decision.
sometimes you wonder if these highly educated govt decision makers are even ‘educated’ …bandage solutions to serious problems inaonyesha hawa watu ni jokers…
You woke people are so entranced by your vision of progress you cannot see how dumb these kids are, introduce corporal punishment and beat these little sh’ts in line.
No Brayo. Anyone who proposes this has not thought it through. It’s good to take a position on serious matters after you have synthesized the arguments for a particular policy proposal. The people who saw it fit to ban corporal punishment during Kibaki’s govt. just a few years ago (Yes, Kibaki’s time was really not too long ago, in socio-cultural developmental terms) were not stupid. They understood that it was detrimental. We would be making a mistake in ignoring the reasoning behind that ban. None of that barbarism goes on in the developed world, and how many schools have lately been burned by students in the UK, US, Japan, Germany, Canada, or Australia?
Schools (dorms, really) are not being burned down because kids arent’t getting caned. It’s sick to think that way. They are being burned due to indiscipline, we are told. What creates indiscipline? Not getting whipped? And suppose we responded to indiscipline in adults by caning them? What creates indiscipline in matatu crews and bodabodas? Not getting whipped? What creates indiscipline in policemen who roughup and injure citizens unprovoked, is it because no one is caning them? Suppose we responded to these instances of “legitimized” indiscipline by caning the adults, what kind of country would Kenya become?
Let’s think of deeper reasons and solutions to indiscipline. Not caning children isn’t one of them. What caning does is it creates trauma and a culture of physical violence. In fact anyone proposing a return to corporal punishment needs anger management therapy.
And I’m not joking.
Indiscipline is caused by people knowing the difference between the wrong thing and the right thing, yet doing the wrong thing intentionally because they know they can get away with it.
US schools level of indiscipline is gun violence, look into those examples before you propose developed worlds methods, and for the record caning is still widespread in Japan.
Kibaki’s government made the decision based on the morals they saw in schools then…these aren’t the same kids they have access to internet and drugs that during our era we couldn’t dream of.
You recommend deep thinking as a solution but pray tell, mtoto akichoma shule juu ya fees…huyu utaongea na yeye mkiambiana nini?..the idiot doesn’t pay fees yet they will still torch the institution.
Kiboko irudishwe, tuache kuzoeana na watoto hio design…Catholic schools ran a tight ship and caning was allowed for good reason, for heaven sakes the Bible says spare the rod and spoil the child.
Anger management therapy…I don’t respect therapy, it’s a tedious exercise where someone explains which words mean what feelings and the end goal is to calm you down into a lethargic state…fcuk that, anger is a natural state, and these kids are pissing me off.
Hehe, you are proving me right. I see you are already getting mad. The trouble with those measures is they are reactionary. We need to have a culture change where people are taught how to handle anger. Anger is not the problem. How to manage it is. One way of managing it is very basic: preventing it before it takes root and grows. The way people speak to one another is very important. It starts with teaching people how to engage with others sensitively. When you take a look at the society wherever you are you’ll notice that there is a way in which people are crude and unkind. That’s the problem. Perhaps you grew up in a place where you couldn’t speak up, a lot of people do. So they take their fear as discipline. If the problem in schools is drugs, that’s is what needs to be addressed. Let’s stop running away from the real issues and start beating all kids to ‘discipline’ them. Caning instils fear, not discipline. Unless, of course you are confusing the two.
Of course I am mad, I’m surprised at how casually you take arson incidents.
Remember that little bitch that went missing, gave the parents a truckload of worry then surfaces up with a hangover and asks mlikua mnanitaftia nini?
Arson issues in schools date way back to the days when kiboko was the order if the day, back then it was even worse, since at times it was targeted killings - if the leadership can not sort out teenage issues … sijui
If you knew me you’d know just how wrong you are in insinuating that I take arson lightly. Suffice it to say that I simply don’t support any form of crime, or behaviour that endangers people. People are my specialty, so I help find solutions to human problems to make the world a better place. It’s just that we see things differently, that’s all.
The age of public boarding schools is over…this kids won’t stomach the nonsense our generation went through…high school was like a prison camp…for a mono it was torture…mtoto aende class mchana…jioni arudi kwa wazazi wake…education aka high schools should be devolved to mashinani…kama primary schools…kinyangarika ikae na mamake nyumbani…hadi imalize high school…
where else in the new world are there public boarding schools??? Sijawai ona…serikali can’t even run prisons and we leave ministry of education in charge of boarding schools some with almost 2000 teenagers…recipe for disaster…hence the fires
Perhaps I was wrong in profiling you, however we’re in the same business of solutions…sometimes you have to remind people of the stick.
I support violence against perpetrators, I don’t believe in the premise that people are inherently good and if you listen to their issues they will become outstanding citizens.
I believe people have a lot of pain in their hearts, and some take it out on other Innocents so the only measure is to remind them that they do not have a monopoly in violence and to reward good behavior.
The majority of whom fall under the wave, will be wise enough to choose the side which caters to their interest.
It’s OK to differ on principle. I believe people have a societal responsibility to take a stand on issues and table their views without fear, coz if we don’t try to shape the future for children, who will?
What I’ve highlighted in your response is my concern–unfair and undeserved punishment being meted out by some teachers to students just because it’s allowed, and you can’t do zilch about it. Those who went to school during the caning years can attest to the fact that there were some really mean teachers. Teachers and students could hardly be friends. Most teachers were not respected, but dreaded. What I know is there are many people who hate their former teachers because of beatings in school, and let’s be honest, it’s beating. So let’s stop sugar coating it like it’s a good thing. Caning is a form of physical, mental and emotional torture. That’s why I don’t support it. Those who don’t want to learn can be sent to approved schools, where a more rigorous discipline regime can be instituted.
@Lionheart how is corporal punishment destructive?
Look at the generations of children raised under the cane and those raised without it, then make your case.
Under the Kibaki govt, we absorbed the litigations of the west, like we do with everything else without weighing it against our needs. You say US kids don’t burn schools, very true. But look at the school shootings and violent gangs in schools.
Caning is the best disciplinary action for children. For secondary school students, it may be too late.
For primary school kids, caning as a deterrent fixes behaviour super fast.
Studies that showed that it was associated with trauma in adulthood were all conducted in the west where abusive parents were more likely to use corporal punishement. So, the trauma is because caning in the west self-selects abusive parents.
In Kenya, ‘normal’ parents, use corporal deterrrents. In a society that doesn’t self-select for abusers, you’ll be surprised at the outcome.
Why in God’s name is friendship with minors revered so much?
Do people suffer from a savior complex where you feel the need to rescue brats from the harsh realities of life?
Fear breeds discipline, you need to learn that you’re a part of a system.
You do not belong to yourself therefore you cannot just do as you please.
Let me just say I know both scenarios, and I still think caning is an unacceptable way of disciplining people. It may look normal to you and others proposing it because that is what you have been brought up to accept as the right way. But you need to remember that much as you castigate the west, even caning in schools was brought by colonists as a means of controlling our grandparents. They too raised children who thought the only stimuli they ought to respect is someone holding a cane or a gun. We are the fools if we fail to graduate beyond this form of cruelty disguised as discipline. Let’s be honest with ourselves. Real discipline means not stealing or destroying property because you understand it’s your property (including school property), not because you fear being beaten or arrested. We must aim at cultivating a higher level of responsibility in children than making them scared of being beaten teachers. No wonder ndindu says black people only understand violence. It is a screaming shame, and we need to realise if these are the decisions we are making we are our own worst enemy. Perhaps the teachers and parents need to examine themselves before trying to pass the buck. But I know if we have even professors reasoning as you are we have a problem.
The best deterrence against any vice or belligerence is to attach a cost to it that any would-be perpetrator would be hesitant to pay. This cost takes many forms in many contexts, from capital/corporal punishment to legal remedies and does not always have to be effected immediately. The cost of arson and indiscipline in Kenyan schools has reduced, so it should either be bumped up or reintroduced. Parents are shouldering the financial cost of indiscipline and the truants get to check back in without much ado. Caning must be the first port of call before engaging parents and other stakeholders on more holistic measures. And when renovating burned structures culprits wapewe kazi za mkono kwa site before/after classes:D. Ati a teenager burning a dorm because politicians set a bad example; invalid rationale that must be neutralized ASAP.
I’m very tempted to agree with you on this, but the behavior of our children are not making the argument in their favor.
I think the removal of corporal punishment was done in good faith, there was however a failure to address any future effects of the move. Discipline cases and teacher-student relations going forward.
It’s been on the news how students are now attacking teachers on their way home.
Now, onto the issue at hand.
Covid-19 has affected everyone and the school calendar was not spared. What the ministry may have done wrong was taking a strongman approach in forcing their way.
Now this is where the danger comes in. There has been clamoring for the abolition of boarding schools since they are “inhumane” to the student.
The students are now feeling confident that they cannot negotiate on anything if they can force their way by either burning dorms or just walking out.
The ministry had a concession and allowed for a half term in the hope that things will calm down.
But no, the schools are back to being burned down or the students refusing to go on with studies. Since it is December and they need holidays.
If we don’t show our children that there needs to be sacrifices for hard times, we’ll be growing with a generation that will never understand that results take hard work. It’s already bad now.
If we allow them to go home in December for holidays as they want, what assurance will we have that come January they won’t burn the same schools if they don’t get their way?
Don’t get things twisted. Corporal punishment isn’t inhumane. Pain has a purpose, a biological purpose, a deterrent purpose.
And kids who were caned when they were young don’t live in fear, they just understand the relationship between action and consequence.
Two strokes of the cane, a pinch etc are very instructive to a child. By the time they are teens, they understand rules and the consequence of not following them.
Compare kids who were caned when they were younger and those who weren’t.
These traumatized people who suffer from the effects of caning when they were young, where are they?
The worst thing you can do to a kid is deny him discipline. A kid MUST understand that you society has laws and rules, and there are consequences.
Indiscipline is VISIBLY relatable to lack of punishment.
The easiest and fastest form of punishment is corporal punishment.
Just once every while, and the threat of it is enough to train discipline.
Not everything western is better.
On this matter, our African forefathers were right.